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My new Vendor Policy...Thoughts?

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  • #16
    Joined the group and it looks to be a promising start of a new way of communicating both good experiences and helping others avoid bad ones. If you're reading this thread, give that group a join and be as active as you can and rember to let your fellow haunters also know of the GOOD experiences you've had as well.

    And with how scripted it was Kevin, and the fact the crazy but cute producer keeps texting me....I can pull some strings. Lol. She's quiet the riot!

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    • #17
      In Defense of Vendors


      So in the 18 years of NETHERWORLD we have purchased stuff from maybe 90% of the vendors in this industry. For those hand making props and animations I think it is virtually impossible not to stumble.


      By stumble I mean A) Being late B) Having a product that fails/breaks unexpectedly C) Having a product that just does not work effectively or ergonomically. It is certainly easier to have no problems if your stuff is simple and static, or is resold/manufactured, but anyone with complex art or mechanics has a tough road ahead.


      Why? Well I think being a vendor is far harder than owning a haunt for one. I think the number of vendors who do this 100% is very small, perhaps a handful, and they are selling to a very small audience to make a living.


      Usually they have a tiny staff and losing even a few employees can send them into a tail spin. Sometimes they need materials or components from other vendors, and if they are late the entire product is delayed. Often we buy new products from them that haven't really been "tested"


      Often they can be amazing artists but not so organized as business men and getting product out is hard. Sometimes the opposite is true and the art is just not there.


      So what to do? WORK with your vendors. You should expect excellence, you paid for it, but understand they (in most cases) are doing their very best to get you your gear. so what should the vendor do?


      COMMUNICATE: Nothing is more maddening than late product with false or zero information. It make customers go crazy. And crazy customers do stupid stuff to vendors like blast them publicly, make a 100 phone calls or do charge backs. Customers, a weakened failing vendor will not perform better by having you harass them.. if anything you will cause them more anguish, and make the product later and of worse quality.


      So Vendors COMMUNICATE and buyers... CHILL. Let them know where you stand and back off so that they can get the work done.


      The final component is RESOLUTION ... coming to terms about a bad Vendor/Customer experience. If a VENDOR is late or does not deliver and the CUSTOMER does not go INSANE usually a deal can be worked out where both walk away satisfied. The key here is to be professional... if a "road rage" attitude happens vendors can lose great customers and haunters will lose access to cool stuff that might bring their haunt to the next level.


      All that said there have been thieves and bad people both haunters and vendors - but almost all of the problems that happen can be fixed by keeping your heads screwed on correctly and not going crazy.


      One final note - these are some of the truths of the haunt industry - "IF IT MOVES IT WILL BREAK" and IF AN ACTOR TOUCHES IT THEY MAY BREAK IT" If you have many animations you had better have steel fabricators available and if you use lots of high end props/costumes, you need skills in latex/foam/costume repair and painting. Also if you have more than a few silicone masks you need local repair options as well. It just goes with the territory....


      Anyway after these long years I am glad to say that there are very few if any existing vendors that we would not work with if we needed what they are selling for a particular theme....It just comes down to mutual respect and COMMUNICATION and RESOLUTION.


      I help TransWorld with many projects and one of my prime motivations is to support the marketplace where our vendors can thrive and survive, so that they can make us cool stuff! So be good to each other!


      Thanks!
      Ben Armstrong
      NETHERWORLD HAUNTED HOUSE
      www.Fearworld.com
      www.NetherworldNetwork.com

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      • #18
        Well said Ben Armstrong.

        Well said Ben Armstrong. Well said!
        COMMUNICATION is really the key word.
        So much can be resolved so easy if you just tell the costumer you are running behind or late or waiting for parts.
        Whatever it is just Communicate.
        99% of the time that will solve the issue before it gets out of control.
        sigpic
        PEACE, ADAM
        www.poisonprops.com

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        • #19
          Ben,
          Exactly!!!
          What I don't understand is really how easy it is to communicate to customers what is happening. All buyers LOVE it and it is fun for us to share that their order is going into production, and when things will be done, or send progress pics along the way. It just makes for a better experience for the customer when you keep them in the loop. Late or not, It is usually all it takes to make it a great experience.

          ALL VENDORS!!!!
          Lesson for the Day.
          Communication is Key. Not doing it is a failure in being a vendor.
          Kevin R. Alvey
          info at gore-galore.com
          www.gore-galore.com
          www.halloweenmusicgalore.com
          www.youtube.com/goregalore13
          www.facebook.com/goregalore


          sigpic

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          • #20
            I have a couple thoughts...

            1) Only work with vendors you have dealt with in the past vendors you know and trust. If you are thinking of working outside that group make sure you feel comfortable talk to your friends, and lastly don't place a giant order make it something manageable to see how it goes.

            2) Communication: I WOULD NOT NOT NOT WORK with ANY vendor you can't have wide open lines of communication. In other words they don't answer their phone, they don't return emails, etc. If that vendor has a bad reputation for not returning phone calls and emails skip them no matter how cool the product is... because communication is everything. You have a deadline and if you can't get updates then you are in the dark... shipping is also key the how when and cost. Maybe its product you have to build a scene around the whole project is held up by one company who doesn't return your calls no thanks.

            We live in the year 2014 nearly 2015. I started in this business there was NO EMAIL, barely cell phones and beepers. I mean c'mon ... now you have everything from skype, phones, text, email, facebook even if you choose to communicate thru facebook. People can also communicate thru so many different social media outlets I mean lets get real we can even facetime. There should NEVER be an excuse for not responding to a customer not today.

            I can understand getting busy, getting sick, going out of town, but when its a non-stop excuse fest its time to give up!

            3) Pay by credit card and only allow vendors to charge you when they are telling you they will start building your product, or in other words they give you a date when it will be complete. So if they say 6 weeks I can live with that let them charge 50%... that is fair balance when you ship. Now at the very least you have some form or recourse if they bail on you... call the credit card company DISPUTE!

            ADVICE TO BUYERS

            1) Sometimes you panic prematurely. Sometimes you jump to unfair conclusions. Sometimes you expect more than what was promised. My point here is to always give the benefit of the doubt have an open mind to always assume the best not the worst. Don't put your relationship on a bad track just because you jump to conclusions.

            Communicate let the vendor respond. Go from there.

            2) Be realistic vendors can't make product on their own dime be prepared to pay at least 50% up front and the balance upon shipment.

            3) Shipping: Sometimes its best to go and pick up the product yourself inspect and pay the balance on the spot therefore there is no confusion.

            Larry
            Larry Kirchner
            President
            www.HalloweenProductions.com
            www.BlacklightAttractions.com
            www.HauntedHouseSupplies.com
            www.HauntedHouseMagazine.com

            Comment


            • #21
              Mistress Obvious

              Just when you think (hope) she's gone...lol.

              I'll never let that ONE vendor off the hook...because he never made me whole (STILL).


              Sue-I feel your pain-and I think every newish haunt owner has similar issues. Ben, Larry...you guys can MAKE or BREAK a vendor...so they are less inclined to take advantage of you (although it does still happen).

              Kevin-we've been down this road-but I want to ask you a question.

              You say that 50% down and 50% cod is unreasonable. I have to question that. If a vendor isn't making at least 100% profit (imho) they aren't going to be IN BUSINESS very long. So, if you're collecting 50% up front-you should have ALREADY covered your "cost". I don't care what business you're in...that's business 101. If you're making a "one of a kind-never to be duplicated item" I can see your point. But if you can't collect on a cod..you STILL have the product which can be sold. A "loss percentage" would be factored into the total price. Haunt vendors may have a small market...but the same can be said of haunt owners. You can't go to amazon and order a hundred "castle wall vacu-form panels" from dozens of sources.

              Credit cards are NOT the end all-beat all answer. I used a credit card with Keith. That account was closed due to a credit breach -which if anyone reading the headlines can tell you-is on the RISE.

              People get divorced...they change banks...they close accounts. When you place an order in march....how many buyers actually GET delivery in June???? After 90 days-even IF you're account is still the same bank/number/etc....you're out of luck. Paypal as well.

              I DO understand both sides of the concern. Personally, I think the haunt industry would do well to imitate what the corn maze industry has done. VET the vendors. With a certain number of satisfactory buyers-a vendor is "preferred". New vendors are listed as new vendors. Any and all complaints are brought to the attention of the convention owners.
              Kathryn DeSautell
              Lafitte's Landing, Dark Shadows Entertainment

              Comment


              • #22
                Kathryn,

                I just want to reply to your question about the 50/50 cod policy.
                As far as Gore Galore doing that. I wish. Just TOOO many bad checks have been passed to us using this method.
                And the problem is for the vendor is that it only takes one or 2 of these big BAD COD checks to honestly put a vendor out of business.
                That is about ALL I can offer on that subject. But it is why we do the 50% deposit/ balance just prior to delivery. But we also provide an exact shipping cost and a tracking # the same or next day.
                However, I understand your point. The problem is kind of like, a locked door only keeps the honest people out.
                What is hard about business is that none of us, even the ones that have been doing it for quite a while really make much money. It is always more about making ends meet, taking care of your employees, making some cool products, earning some new clients each year, and hopefully, and I mean hopefully. Not having to kick ALL the profits back to the govt at the end of the year.
                And if you think I am kidding you can sit down with me and my accountant.
                Believe it or not, 2 years ago, we lost money. YUP, LOST money, and lost enough to put most vendors out of business. But we are still here because this is my passion. My Love!!!! and the only thing I want to do.


                BUT I think your preferred vendor concept is a great idea. A vendor has to EARN their place.
                I had to earn mine, and it took a long time, and I think ALL vendors should. And Honestly, they do.
                In the long run ALL vendor's earn a reputation and build that reputation by either doing good business or not.
                But it is the LONG run. SOme luck out and continue on regardless of their reputations, but most do not last long if they are NOT taking care of their customers.

                But this is why we started the Haunt Vendor Review.
                https://www.facebook.com/groups/764567573606370/

                It is nothing special except what it does do is allow buyers to post their reviews of vendors, and allows vendors to see these reviews. Yes, it is a complex thing trying to keep the reviews honest, and keeping the vendors from getting upset. Trying to keep your personal judgements under control. But give it some time.
                1 review doesn't say much, but when a vendor starts collecting 5 or 6 reviews you start to see something emerge. A reputation, either good or bad.
                But you really start to get a good idea what is going on.
                But it could give you a clue who the Preferred vendors are.
                ALL buyers are welcome to join and leave comments, reviews and hopefully at some point this will be a good resource for buyers to use to learn something about vendors.
                IN addition, It is a good resource for vendors too, because if they know buyers are going to be posting respectfully, they get some valuable feedback that might help them become better vendors.
                Kevin R. Alvey
                info at gore-galore.com
                www.gore-galore.com
                www.halloweenmusicgalore.com
                www.youtube.com/goregalore13
                www.facebook.com/goregalore


                sigpic

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                • #23
                  Good Start.

                  Thanks for the reply Kevin. Hopefully this site will be well known to buyers/potential buyers at each convention/tradeshow.

                  What would be ideal is a impartial spokesperson. Someone who is neither a buyer or a vendor-but is knowledgeable about the industry.
                  Kathryn DeSautell
                  Lafitte's Landing, Dark Shadows Entertainment

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    That is MUCH tougher than it sounds.

                    How we deal with that is we have several admins. A group board made up of a couple vendors and a couple buyers.

                    the other thing is it is strictly a group for Reviews.
                    It doesn't deal with anything else. It doesn't make any moral or ethical statements about vendors or buyers. It doesn't say whether a vendor is a rip off artist, a user or anything to that effect.
                    It strictly posts reviews, and attempts to post them in a non emotionally charged way.

                    That allows the buyers to give their experience with a vendor and then since it is communicated respectfully that helps the vendor see where the buyer is coming from if there has been an issue.

                    It is kind of like when you want to explain something to an employee to help them do a better job. DO you yell and scream at them? Of course not. That doesn't work. It just makes people defensive.
                    You communicate in a calm collect tone so they can adsorb the information without getting angry about it.

                    This is how we are trying to handle this group.

                    information for buyers/feedback for vendors.
                    Last edited by Gore Galore; 12-05-2014, 06:17 AM.
                    Kevin R. Alvey
                    info at gore-galore.com
                    www.gore-galore.com
                    www.halloweenmusicgalore.com
                    www.youtube.com/goregalore13
                    www.facebook.com/goregalore


                    sigpic

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