Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

How much to Pay

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • How much to Pay

    If you've been scaring people for years, top notch actor in the building, how much do you think an owner should pay for one of the best actors? How much should new actors be paid and everything in between.

    Just wanted everyone's view.

    Larry
    Larry Kirchner
    President
    www.HalloweenProductions.com
    www.BlacklightAttractions.com
    www.HauntedHouseSupplies.com
    www.HauntedHouseMagazine.com

  • #2
    Use a merit system, have them bring in the scalps from each night , countem up!

    Happy customers exiting , no real complaints, people getting right back in line to buy another ticket......

    Then you KNOW for sure. the only thing is , this experience is usually not just all about THE MONEY.
    I sure try to do the right thing by my helpers here but I totally ruined a very good helper once , I gave him a cash bonus for a really good job. The next year he was out there, doing whatever his moods dictated, illreguardless of how purely annoying or hindering to other helpers and customers he was being.
    Nobody enjoyed, nobody was entertained, nobody was scared, then he decided to just not show up on a couple of the busiest nights of the year without warning because he took his "talents" down-the-road. The other place found they couldn't tolerate a loose cannon to such a degree either.
    All very sad. A waste of potential.
    hauntedravensgrin.com

    Comment


    • #3
      Wage scale.

      The top of the line real asset actor would compare to how much a DJ, an MC or band member would make in a night. Provided they are seriously bringing something to the event. So this ranges $120 to $200 a night. Wether they realize it or not, this sounds wonderful to make as much as $50 an hour but, this limits them to only being wanted on certain nights. If you don't reward someone that has invested in one or more quality characters they are indeed likely to become part of the midway instead of the cast.

      On the low end of the scale, slighltly above minimum wage is acceptable. It is maybe a dollar more than minimum wage because it is a temporary position. Then there is the fact that over the years with demonstrated investment and continued participation in education, they will increase a bit every year and one day might have that $20 per hour or more position.

      The lower end has occasional perks like coming to pick them up and get them back home to arranging others to car pool them their. Little things like that are really appreciated by those that can not provide for themselves or otherwise be left out of the fun.

      Because the entire involvement is under 90 days, they can be signed up from anything from having to report to a temporary company that will be handling the payroll to an independent contractor that will be making their own investment in the tools of the trade and will get paid in November. Making the bigger bucks also comes with the responcibility to genuinely provide a service to the event. They should be submitting a bill with some amount of pre agreed upon time to pay. This confirms their independent non employee status for tax purposes.

      It is also possible that this star is to realize his stardom is only required two nights per season and all other hours will be at a much reduced rate as he gets on the job familiarity with the type of customers and layout of the facilities.

      It is different per region but here $10 to $12 cost after taxed and such is quite the commitment from a company. Especially mutiplying this by 30 to 75 positions. So the normal increase from year to year is a scale of not being a problem, doing the job and progressing at 50 cents to $1 per year to the maximum $10 to $12 rate per hour. This might be 6 years of involvement.

      A star negotiation would have their own high quality costume developed, be able to explain or demonstrate what they are going to do and do what they said they were going to do.

      Any deal with an employee or long term character is difficult only in getting the what do you want from them. If the upper level wants to be treated like an employee they get employee rates. If they have the mindset of being able to provide a legitimate service as a signature character, sometime it is simply haveing the freedom to be who and where they want to be. I have watched events at wander in time and the bands and DJs and MCs aren't all that whereas the actors are in fact getting it and it is a shame they are not compensated at such levels.

      in the long run, those providing a service are worth 4 times the hassle of the ones that need everything provided to them to still do half of the job. On the same token there are a lot of unproven individuals that will walk right in and suggest that they be your partner with 60% of the door and they will show you how it is done, never having even been to a haunted house. Usually these kind of people have been to prison. I think they learn how to do this there and always have to go back for refresher courses it seems.
      sigpic

      Another fabulous post from the U.S.Department of Wild Imaginings, now in spectaclar stereo, sponsored by the Adhesives and Sealants Council, suggesting ways to stick things together since the 1800s. Not fabulous in a gay way. Your results may vary. Illinois residents add 8% sales tax. These posts have been made by professional post makers, do not try this type of posting on your own without extensive training, lovely assistants and a trusty clown horn.

      Comment


      • #4
        ..and that 60% of the particulair "Door" they are referring to is the Women's Restroom door.
        50cents a peek through the magic veiw finder hidden in the center of the door.
        hauntedravensgrin.com

        Comment


        • #5
          Ya i would agree a percentage off the door! If they are in charge of all the actors. The very best & top actor you have you cant afford to loose this person. They can make or break your haunt and keep moral of your other actors up as long as you keep this person happy and on your side.
          Damon
          Damon Carson

          Comment


          • #6
            you mean us actors are supposed to make money? whooooooa wait a minute...
            Buried deep beneath Darksyde acres Haunted house In Michigan I'm the Best at what I do, What I do Isn't very NICE!

            Comment


            • #7
              I never would have realized that the pay was so low on the scale. so i had always figured on what i could afford what i wnated to take home if any and to be willing to make exceptioons for those special individuals. wow 20 bucks an hours for a seasonal job you had better be good unless i am just making good money then i always agree with passing on the good fortune to others with bonuses or insintives.

              i think the big dollars would come down to camera views punctionality, scares, charachter, personality and dedication to the BLACK ARTS. LOL
              The Care Taker
              John "DarkTombCreations.com"

              Comment


              • #8
                ..and by chance would that $20 hr. pay check be directly connected to the black art of blackmailing the boss?
                I have had employment where this happened. My Father told me,"Never dip your pen in the company ink." (or then you will find yourself using ink to write out pay checks for some very unmotivated workmanship.)
                I used to watch as a female inkwell got a paycheck for a week but only working for about 3 hours each week.
                OK, I was jealous, I just wasn't the Bosse's type, I guess?
                He was too tall, and the bloody butcher knife he always was holding in his left hand made me nervous too!
                He was a surgeon. Never saved even one cow, pig or chicken that he worked on.
                hauntedravensgrin.com

                Comment


                • #9
                  Tell me this... Sort of on the same topic...

                  If you had a 3rd year actor, someone who stuck with you through good times and bad. Helped with building, developed promotional materials (radio and tv commercials, flyers, website design, etc.), made their own costumes, and acted in the show. At the LEAST a solid 3 to 4 month commitment to your show every year. Certainly an asset if not more.

                  All of a sudden, this person doesn't show up on a Saturday night (second weekend in the season) and doesn't return for the rest of the season. No explanation, just for "personal reasons".

                  No amounts previously agreed upon, only an understanding that they would be duely compensated as they had in years past. Would you pay this person?

                  Would you at least return their phone calls? Return equipment to them that they had let you borrow?
                  To look meant danger, to smile meant death!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Actiondeath,

                    I would pay this person what ever the lowest paid actor recieved an hour for they hours they had worked that year. I would also make sure that they got any personal items that they owned returned to them. And I would for sure call them back.

                    Howie "Slobber" Erlich
                    Owner
                    Deadly Intentions Haunted House
                    www.deadlyintentionshaunt.com
                    1986-1997 (Mutilation Mansion,) 1998 (Screamers Haunted House,) 1999 (Evil Intention Haunted House,) 2000-2001 Concept Creator/Business Partner (Urban Legends Haunted House,) 2002 Floor Plan Designer and Consultant for a (Haunted Barn) Owners had city challenges & were never able to open, 2002 Floor Plan Designer/Construction (Fright Nights Haunted House) 2003-2012 Now retired Owner (Deadly Intentions Haunted Attraction)

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I figured as much. Hell, gas money at least. I drove about 80 miles, round trip, to the haunt at least a dozen times before the season even started. Not to mention the video work. It's been shot, edited, delivered, and used and I haven't received a dime for it. Worst part about it is that I considered the owner a very close friend.

                      I've had a couple of other workers e-mail me recently wondering why they haven't been paid. They have been unable to contact the owner and knew that I worked closely with him. It's just a shame when you trust someone. Granted, I didn't give notice when I left, but that doesn't mean that the work I did was for free. God only knows what these kids did to piss him off to the point that they won't get paid either.

                      I guess I'll know better next time around.
                      To look meant danger, to smile meant death!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Employee/employer relationship

                        The haunt season is like taking a bunch of new hires with all the expectations of any other corporate benefit laden enterprise. The thing is, the money comes from the customers and the big break even and profit (if there is any) is in the last two weeks of the event.

                        All year long I have new people show up for work, expecting all the easy stuations that former jobs had afforfed them and more. Usually they aren't expecting to hang around and put out as such, that much intrest. Yet, with in 3 days the barrage of questions comes up. Okay, it's day two and I took a bath, what kind of raises will I be getting. How about just fireing everyone you have and make me your foreman partner and I'll show you how to make money. It will be great when I get that 60 hour a week check (when it is winter and we work 30) (and I'm not 28 anymore) chances are they might want to consider a second job?

                        Then rarely you have the go getter that runs around doing things of great quality, showing their capabilities all the while sort of making their own mind up as to what these tasks and how many days rather than hours these things should take.

                        The the other questions, is there hospitalization? is there a retirement program? I sure would like to join a health club and get healthy.

                        Answers: No there is no hospitalization, we don't hire sick people, if you are too sick to work we can drop you off at the salvation army.

                        Answer: The retirement program is simple, who ever falls over dead, you get to go through their pockets. Just a warning, so far it hasn't been me your boss, it has been a few employees.

                        Answer: A health club? Okay the premium membership costs $3,000 and includes an endless supply of towels. Just start bringing in those 50 pond bafs of material and I will deduct it from your check.

                        My latest over demanding helper last worked for the city who had no problem having them work lots of overtime doing mindless work to no specific quality. They had somebody sitting in an office faxing the time cards and yet another on the tax payers tab driving around delivering checks and collecting time cards. I really had to sit back and understand this fantasy world of endless expectation. I came to realize the city pays no rent, no taxes because they are the government, and have budgets of millions already for the taking posted years ago for this.

                        In comparison a small business or haunt gets all their income from some kind of customer. Then they pay for a shop, all the transportation, spend hours training for something that isn't supposed to be done mindlessly, they have to pay taxes on the employee and everything and every dime that passes through their hands and pays sales tax on all the minor expendatures and if the customers are slow to pay or unimpressed, the getting any resources part gets to be a little tricky.

                        Plus, in case this guy didn't notice, the city kind of dumped him at the end of the season so you had to look for a job and came to work with us. So how great of a gig was that really? I'll bet they faxed the report that said they won't be needing you anymore. I don't even have a fax machine. Here's a pencil.

                        Plus it seems we are coming to get you, dropping you off, taking you to the bank to get your check cashed and buying your lunch. Did the city do any of that?

                        We also seem to get calls where people who have no idea where we will be working are telling us they won't be coming in due to the rain. All the while we have some indoor projects as well as things to do at the shop.

                        Possibly it isn't that you got ripped off but, no one cared wether the customers came, were impressed, satisfied and enough of them came to pay everyone. Possibly some people imagined that doing their own campaigne of sorts would help even if not delivered and should be compensated for, but, they kind of took it upon themselves to do this with no prior agreement as to how much it would cost or what the benefits would be.

                        There is nothing wrong with beeing gung ho and contributing beyond what is expected and expecting some kind of end compensation for one's efforts. The thing is is needs to be completed work that derives an income from some kind of customer or provides a true benefit that increased the number or the satisfaction of the customers.

                        Usually the end goal of the go getter is to be there in the end having created the opportunities for reward AND being there to see the program through to a great conclusion.

                        Just doing a bunch of things with great enthusiasm and quitting short has no value at all. Unfortunately in the business world, if they are your employee you have kind of paid them anyhow.

                        In comparison, I have three people in different parts of the country that sort of inherited businesses that I got tired of. They prospered for decades to this day and simply got rewarded for showing up and doing what was necessary. I actually learned from these people how to take over a company by being the best employee and even being a financial contributor. All too many business owners never thought of what a headache every aspect of business could be or how hard it was to make ends meet to the extent that when they had to pay taxes, someone else has to make their payroll. You are only one step away from serving their customers directly with out a drop of a heart beat when they quit.

                        At this point you are already sort of doing everything, you just go to work. However, the school system or families or who ever (the prison system) have brain screwed everyone into that expected income simply by demand with no real skill, knowledge or investment in plan or thought or sweat.

                        Sure, just walk in and it is yours even though you have no idea what the skills are or what the great line of tasks could become that have been "expected performance" of the company for decades. Even on the Today Show they say the best way to lose friends is to have money dealings with them. Or when one has no idea as to what it takes to develop the resources it took to create what is seen as possibly a blank check with no end scheme really in place.

                        And while I'm bitching....

                        would you rather work 60 hours at $7 per hour or 30 hours at $12? It amazes me how many people think that the 60 hour job is better. After taxes it is the identical net income even with overtime but, apparently the school system has failed in math as well.

                        I'm sure that next spring the city will call our helper with their exciting offer. Do you want a career that leads to a $30 per hour income and self owned business or do you want to run a weed eater for 60 hours a week? I will decide at that time which fate is better for him.

                        (insert the Jepardy song here)
                        sigpic

                        Another fabulous post from the U.S.Department of Wild Imaginings, now in spectaclar stereo, sponsored by the Adhesives and Sealants Council, suggesting ways to stick things together since the 1800s. Not fabulous in a gay way. Your results may vary. Illinois residents add 8% sales tax. These posts have been made by professional post makers, do not try this type of posting on your own without extensive training, lovely assistants and a trusty clown horn.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Greg Chrise View Post
                          Possibly it isn't that you got ripped off but, no one cared wether the customers came, were impressed, satisfied and enough of them came to pay everyone. Possibly some people imagined that doing their own campaigne of sorts would help even if not delivered and should be compensated for, but, they kind of took it upon themselves to do this with no prior agreement as to how much it would cost or what the benefits would be.

                          There is nothing wrong with beeing gung ho and contributing beyond what is expected and expecting some kind of end compensation for one's efforts. The thing is is needs to be completed work that derives an income from some kind of customer or provides a true benefit that increased the number or the satisfaction of the customers.

                          Usually the end goal of the go getter is to be there in the end having created the opportunities for reward AND being there to see the program through to a great conclusion.

                          Just doing a bunch of things with great enthusiasm and quitting short has no value at all. Unfortunately in the business world, if they are your employee you have kind of paid them anyhow.
                          I see your point, and yes, I did a few things that the owner did not expect me to do, and I do not and never have expected payment for these things. My costumes are a good example. However, you really shouldn't hire anyone to do anything for you unless you are 100% positive that you will be able to pay them. I don't care by what standards or point of view you look at it from, I was ripped off.

                          The fact is, I was asked to design flyers, I did. I was asked to shoot and edit two television commercials, I did. I was asked to shoot and edit several short films for queue line entertainment, I did. I was asked to produce two radio ads, I did. Also, this wasn't a 'Here's the final cut, see ya' situation. I produced drafts of everything and worked with the owner until he was pleased. I don't know who you hire to do similar work, but I guarantee they wouldn't do it for a pat on the back or for 'the thrill' of working in a haunted house. 'Thrill' isn't a widely accepted currency, so I had buy my equipment with hard earned money.

                          I could reverse your statements and claim that perhaps he didn't pay me because he doesn't know what skill and how many hours are involved with graphic design and audio/visual editing and production. I'll tell you this, if he had hired a different company to do it they would have been paid before they even started rolling. They would've been paid a lot more than I ever asked for with no question as to how many customers their product appealed to. That's a gamble you take with advertising mediums. You approve the final and that's that. You can't go back and say "well, I didn't make as much money as I had expected to make so I'm not paying you."

                          It was planned. He had everything in his hands before he turned on me. When I stopped acting in the show, that sealed it for him. I'm the sucker for not seeing it coming before it was too late.
                          To look meant danger, to smile meant death!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            They should be paid what is owed to them. This takes any debt off your books and clears things for what may or may not happen later.
                            Employees who ditch the haunt on a busy October weekend may not realise how much this potentially hurts the quality and safety of the show. It might be tempting as the owner to deduct a certain amount from what is owed because of this factor but then when it comes right down to it, I am a softy usually and I wouldn't be deucting anything.
                            Maybe haunt owners should come up with a formula as to the actual value a weekend emplyee is to the show on those Friday and Saturday nights though. I have also been left in the proverbial "Lurch" by such absentees, most of which were for no real or valid reason, just quirky attitudes, usually.
                            The "best" one was when a relative working for me left at 9pm on an October Sat. night because he had to suddenly be in a town 10 miles away "looking at an apartment"?
                            It was extremely aggreivating to have family employees who had such unreasonable feelings (or mental awareness absences?). One bragged to the non-family employees that I couldn't fire him because he was "family"...he was very wrong, he discovered.
                            If you wouldn't tolerate a non-family employee "scuttling your ship" then why would I allow a family member to do such harm (or potential harm?)
                            hauntedravensgrin.com

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Taking advantage of rippoffs

                              All you describe is probably a pay out of from $4,000 to who knows. Technically this is more than $800 and felony fraud on one hand if the quality of the product could be seen fit by non participant. However, in the real world an attorney to even consider this debate will be a minimum end bill of $6500 and so it isn't worth any such litigation.

                              So to properly recoupe your loses (of which sorry to say I have had a dew providing service to haunted houses) you have to consider this part of your resume. Perhaps the portfolio of your work which in any other bigger industry begins with a $25,000 marketing survey about what people would be intrested in most.

                              As it has not been paid for, it is yours to use as an example to display a sample of your skill and accomplishment. Not necessarily that you would be going directly into the field of edvertising or creating advertisment for haunted houses as a job or career but, At least this is completed work and proves you are capable of such things. In the real world of course it may only be seen as "inspired or passionate" but it is better than not having any affilitation with any thing.

                              Consider it branding. let the free market decide if it is worth creating a demand for. In this instance you are going to use it as a sample of your work that puts you into the $4,000 to who knows how much catagory rather than dude, i just want my gas money.

                              Even if you chose not to do any other advertising piece for anything ever again, it means having done it (even for thrill) made you aware of all the conceptual problems and considerations. It gave you an opinion about what could be done in the future with more resources and something to go on.

                              In a way this was an education. Unfortunately ther is that lack of class in this industry about people saying they would pay you and then when it comes time to pay, oh, didn't that other guy pay you? It is totally wrong and even those that did pay I had to send Vampirella lose on them to collect.

                              I have threatened to come get complete haunts with semi trucks over $200. It is so sad. I've spent more resources collecting than was due on general principal. Now, generally I understand things happen occasionally but in the haunted house thing lots of very hard work over years ended up not even being much more than one more line on my resume.

                              I will say this name dropping did get me a location, a sponsor, an entire acting troup and advertising that all would have cost this easy $25,000. All earned by getting ripped of for smaller amounts.

                              In retrospect, I could be small and say there are some things I won't be doing because it would benefit these people directly with my hard earned cash but, you know what? They ended up being good references for additional work. Even with out name dropping (as in other fields these people are no body) but, calling out the locations of the haunts, I recently got an easy faux finish no one could figure out how to do and I was confident and informative because I have done something similar on a large surface before.

                              I consider it all free research. A place to test yourself. Of course after a decade of doing this, you have learned enough to do your own events. Education is very expensive. You could have mispent your own money in an event and that is worse than having field tested your capabilities, even testing/training your helpers for expenses incurred.

                              I can tell how well you responded to my not knowing anything that this will be an asset to you in the future.
                              Last edited by Greg Chrise; 01-12-2008, 10:14 PM.
                              sigpic

                              Another fabulous post from the U.S.Department of Wild Imaginings, now in spectaclar stereo, sponsored by the Adhesives and Sealants Council, suggesting ways to stick things together since the 1800s. Not fabulous in a gay way. Your results may vary. Illinois residents add 8% sales tax. These posts have been made by professional post makers, do not try this type of posting on your own without extensive training, lovely assistants and a trusty clown horn.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X