Based on an argument going on.. How many here are christians?

[mindtumor]

Jack

Do you think that all people that follow God and accept Jesus as savior believe in the false Christianty that Rome pushed through those many years ago? Some of us do actually know that Rome took pagan holidays and made them their own so they could push through their own false christianity. The one I would think is most obvious to everyone is Easter. Good Friday to Easter Sunday isn't even 72 hours yet people celebrate it as though it is 3 days in the tomb and Christ rises. I have never been in a church in this country that could even obey the second commandment in its entirety.

Here is a question for everyone: Who are the people of Israel and where these people are today? Does anyone know the answer to that?

I don't mind politely discussing these things with people, I don't know all of the answers but I do know a few things if people want to discuss.

[lurker]

DarkAngel
Hell, I have a few minutes in the morning to kill while I drink my coffee, and I was hoping to recruit some of free labor from all the folks that have hours to write personal dissertations on their faith on a haunted house message board. Sorry, please carry on with your fun.

[Darkangel]

Jared,

It wasn't false Christianity that Rome pushed, there were some changes but it was generally off the teachings and direction of the deciples spreading the wroe and their writings. Early Christianity was by far more pure than it is today with some sects that pop up.

Darkangel

[jack]

Darkangel, I don't think you'd accept anything I put forth as 'miraculous'. In fact, I think you'd call them 'myths'. Because that's what you've been taught.

But you need to understand that what is called 'myth' when it's non-Christian is called 'parable', 'gospel', and 'sermon' when it IS Christian.

There are thousands of 'miracles' in what's called mythology--including a worldwide flood, virgin births, endless food, resurrection--pretty much every miracle that's in the Bible.

In classic belief, Jesus Christ is what's known as a 'hero'--the child of a human and a god--just like Heracles.

Doesn't that sound silly? But it only sounds silly because Heracles is myth--a fairy story--fiction, right?

Heracles even 'ascended'--leaving his humanity behind, just like Christ.

And they did not think that thunder and lightening were the result of god--any more than Christians do(God controls nature, Darkangel, so He does control the thunder and lightening, no?)--but they DID believe that some of the gods could direct lightening....a belief that has not completely gone away(see 'Act of God').

Shane, I am saying that you enjoy all the pagan trappings of Halloween as much as any of us--and they are pagan. I used the term 'devil worship' to point out that it's because of Christians that many haunted houses avoid scenes with devils and demons. We've actually had to remove them because of complaints. And yet they carve their jack o'lanterns and put up their symbols of death and romanticize the witches they once persecuted.

I don't hold anyone's Christianity against them, why do you feel free to hold my faith against me?

I don't ape your holidays or try to cash in on them. Yet you seem to feel it's fine to glom on to our holidays while disparaging us for having beliefs that support the very holiday you love.

Why, I can't--in an industry that should have no problem with it--openly express my beliefs without getting a load of crap for it. Because the idea that Halloween is a pagan based holiday upsets Christians.

As you put it 'people like you give us all ( haunters) a bad name'. The horrible thing is, you're right. If I go too far off the Christian-approved path, I could hurt my fellow haunters.

And the only reason for that is the sad fact that many Christians will not 'live and let live'.

So I will not shut up. I will speak, and try to help you see that we 'pagans' who work alongside you in the haunt industry are not misguided or damned or subject to your scorn.

And, while it'd be nice if more came out of the 'broom closet' here, I understand THAT silence all too well. Too many of us are silenced in fear for our jobs--or our friendships. But we're here.

[kpolley]

Well, I've tried to avoid getting re-involved in this because the tone was changing for the worst...but here I go again.

First, let me say that this thread was started because of my comments about my faith and my claim that lots of haunters are Christians. I never intended for a mess to follow where everyone fought about what they believed. I welcome non-Christians to share their thoughts with me. We need an open dialogue between all people of different and of no faiths. The problem is that too often and for far too long Christians have been seen as self-righteous, exclusive, hypocrites and we aren'tfurthering the kingdom by perpetuating these views. As a Christian, specifically to those who aren't, I'd like to say a couple things.

Christians ARE all of the bad thigns you think we are! We love God and follow his teachings...and at the same time we fall short all the time. The Bible tells us how we should live our lives and we fail to do that time and time again. We fail to show unconditional love to everyone, not just those we like. We fail to BE Christ to the World. On top of that there are vast numbers of people who call themselves Christians but have either twisted the scriptures till they are unrecognizeable or simply speak without ever living the words they say. All of this is true. Please don't judge Christ by his followers, however. We are just sinners saved by Grace. Look to Christ himself, look to the Bible to decide what to make of Christianity. Read one of the Gospels (Mathew, Mark, Luke, or John) and see what you think of Jesus for yourself. I wouldn't be a Chsitian myself if I only looked at other Christians to decide if the faith had merit.

I'd also like to share with you all, if you are interested, the origins of my faith so that you can at least understand better where I am coming from. I grew up in the church from infancy, like many people who grow up in the midwest. I went to church every Sunday, but found myself bored and uninterested in Christianity by the time I reached high school. I continued to attend church with my family, but my faith had completely eroded away. One summer, a good friend of mine asked me to help with a week of camp he was doing at the Christian summer camp our church helped support. I agreed because I had attended when I was young and thought it would be fun. As the week went by I began to feel a nagging at my heart, something subtle at first and then more and more prominent. By Thursday night, I was feeling terrible. I realized that I had been living two lives. One where I was a Christian at church and this just great guy, and then one the rest of the week where I did things my way and had no relationship with Christ. That night, after the services, I went off by myself for a couple hours and broke down. I prayed, honestly prayed for the first time in years, and told God that I had to change. I was living two lives that couldn't coexist. I decided then and there to turn it all over to God and begin living the life I knew He wanted me to.

That was eight years ago. The road has not been easy for me, but I didn't expect it would. God never promises an easy path for his followers. In fact, He tells us there will be trials and often more trials just for following Him. I don't follow to have it good. I don't follow because I want to avoid Hell (although I do want to avoid Hell). I follow because God came to Earth in the form of a man, walked among us, and eventually gave his life in a terrible wayso that I could be made free from my sins. How could I not follow? When you truly understand the need for and the impact of the cross it is a powerful experience.

If anyone out there is curious to at least check this whole God thing out, let me suggest a couple great resources. First, the Bible. If you're looking for something else, however, try Mere Christianity by C.S. Lewis or The Reason for God by Timothy Keller. Both books are really well written and lay out logical arguments for the existence of God. Although I love the Keller book, I would suggest Mere Christianity to non-Christians first. The book is incredible and is not a preachy book. Lewis simply lays the foundation of who God is and why He is as He is.

Lastly, to all the Christians on this forum who are beating up on others and especially beating up on the non-Christians...shame on you. We are called to be Christ to the world. Our one mission is to spread the gospel and to lead people to Christ. This negativity and hate are intolerable. Christ would never have spoken to an unbeliever the way some of you are speaking to each other. The religious leaders of His day were horrific in nearly every way, but Christ was respectful to them anyway. We should learn to actually follow His example, not just talk about it. Remember, you were bought with a price. God made He who knew no sin to be sin for all of us. Christians are looked to by the World as examples of Christ and we have all done a terrible job of representing him. That has to stop. As much as the angels cheer when another soul comes to know Christ we will be called to task for all those we have led astray through our words and actions.

[graystone]

Jack

Why Not start a pagan thread? Why hijack a christian one? What part of that don't you understand! Shane and its.... whats so hard about starting a thread on your own belief's? Shane this time.

P.S. Kip my friend good to see you. You know Kip here is how Shane see's it. Some spread the word of God much like your doing here and that's great man. Some on the other hand defend God himself much as I am doing. I hope you can see that.

[Jim Warfield]

The Scene Locally:

Aprox. 110 people showed up to hear a traveling "evangilist" speak.
"There are at least 10 Satanists in this very room!".........
No there weren't.
Was everyone then looking more closely at their neighbors they have known for 60 years?
Retired people, nice people. Very normal, social, rural people?
This is the sort of crap that just binds my shorts up.
Does God exist? Look through almost any National Geographic magazine. Look at the wonders and diversity in nature from the depths of the oceans to the sub atomic particles, all in full color!
I "rest" my case.
If you treat others right you will sleep better at night.
Life can be very simple.

[Darkangel]

Jack,

we get it, you're Pagan you don't believe in Christianity we're stealing YOUR Holidays yada yada yada. You're going in circles, start a new thread about Paganism and see if you can scrape up one or two people who still follow those beliefs. I'm not knocking you for your beliefs, you're free to worship as you see fit.


Kip, great post very insightful!


Darkangel

[Greg Chrise]

Yeah, and sometimes National Geographic shows boobies too!

[TheGreatPhantasmo]

Question for you TheGreatAzzHole I mean Phantasmo. Again why are you here. The spelling thing just shows I am who I am no need to cheat or act like a fool as you just did. So I make a few mistakes here and there. Just as your making a mistake by coming here acting like Superman trying to save the day! Wow 17 post to this date that's a real way to make friends here. When you made your post did you use spell check? Are you really a smart azz or a real true smart azz. Shread made it very clear what this post was about and here you go. Dude trust me I know these guys and for someone who seems new to the industry you just bought yourself a big old black ball!

Shane and its way to go! Another one bites the dust! Shane this time!

Really? This is a joke right?

I have 17 posts so what i have to say doesn't matter? I don't have alot of posts because , frankly, alot of the posts on this board aren't worth contributing to.

I've been in the industry going on 9 years now, I wouldn't exactly call that new. Black Balled? Seriously? You're gonna have people "not be my friends" because I disagreed with you on a MESSAGE BOARD? Grow up man.

And no, I don't use spell check. I just know how to spell.

[TheGreatPhantasmo]

Why Not start a pagan thread? Why hijack a christian one? What part of that don't you understand! Shane and its.... whats so hard about starting a thread on your own belief's? Shane this time.

P.S. Kip my friend good to see you. You know Kip here is how Shane see's it. Some spread the word of God much like your doing here and that's great man. Some on the other hand defend God himself much as I am doing. I hope you can see that.

This is a legit question. Ive noticed in some of your posts they contain "Shane and its" and "Shane this time."

What is this? I dunno if it's something editing weird of if it's something you know you're saying. I am legitimately just curious as to what it is.

[HauntPhReAk]

I don't think Shane has said anything offensive. He is a Christian and everyone thinks that is ok but everyone wants him to accept everyone else's faith as well? That doesn't make sense because to him being a Christian is an end all thing, so why would he say I am a Christian but you are right, and you are right, and you are right. If he said he thought he was right and everyone else was also right wouldn't he be weak in faith and contradicting himself? What do you want him to say?

Wow this post was made a long time ago and is still at the top of the forum, definately my most popular post!

Thanks for your input!

-Zack Cooper
www.shreddershalloweenscreampark.com

No, of course Shane doesn't have to agree with what he doesn't believe. What I want from Shane is for him to quit telling everyone that if they are not Christian and therefore have views different from his, they can only vote and cannot voice their opinion on this thread.

That makes absolutely no sense, whether it was what Shredman originally intended or not. If it was his original intention, he should have said so up front and not come back almost a year later (YESTERDAY) after a two-sided conversation had been taking place the entire time and suddenly said so (likely because he was pushed to do so). He had already checked in TWO WEEKS AGO and commented that he was surprised by how much response he was getting but never made any mention that he meant for only Christians to respond. He thanked everyone for their input TWO WEEKS AGO. See second quote above.

If you ask an open-ended question in a poll, then you should be prepared for people to answer, and you should welcome all answers. Think of it as a learning experience and listen to what they have to say, if nothing else.

I also want Shane and others to quit calling people horrible names and insulting them when they don't agree with them. That is NOT acceptable. The way "monkeys" and "aliens" are used by him and anyone else to speak to others verbally and through videos speaks volumes about those using them. And I believe anyone using those as insults owes others an apology.

It is NEVER OK to insult others to try to convert them or to threaten to black ball somebody from the haunt industry because they disagree with you. That is my belief, and I also agree with whoever suggested AGAIN that it is time to delete this entire thread (poll).

[graystone]

Let me say it once more....

Heck maybe I cant spell but surly you guys can read! Start a thread on what you believe in! What part of that don't you understand? Are you stupid? Your going on and on and on JUST START A THREAD ABOUT YOUR BELIEFS AND STOP TRYING TO HIJACK A CHRISTIAN THREAD! Can you do that? Will you do that? Why want you do that? Again I don't believe we were pulled from a monkeys uterus no more than a space ship droped us off. You nuts know where I am going if your smart enough to build awsome haunts then your smart enough to get my point! I assure you I will not come to your thread and tell you how to believe. So you stay off this one and I will stay off yours. DANG ITS SIMPLE! Shane and its thats how I feel! Shane this time.

[graystone]

Thinking about all of this....

I was driving down the road today and was thinking about this thread. I think its best I move away from it. I have said my peace and have made my beliefs known. I think in his own way God said Shane your friends and peers gets the message and thats whats most important.

I will be the person that I am and say if I have offended anyone I will be the bigger person and do the right thing and say I am sorry. I am sorry if I offended anyone my beliefs are strong and solid so if I hurt anyone even Tyler I will say I am sorry that I took my beliefs over the line. I will not and cannot say I am sorry for what I believe in its who I am and its what has got me through very rough times. I have said this before God has given me more than I could ever have imagined whether it be through my company, my family,my animals or my bank account I am truly blessed!

At the end of the day we all choose different roads and paths to take. Some will choose the right road others will not but at the end of the day thats really not for me to judge. I think I am doing the right thing here and just letting it go. I will probably check in on it from time to time. But I am laying my sword down and walking away. This is what I think God wants me to do. Am I the looser here? NO, NO, NO I am doing what God has told me to do. I am just a fighter in his army and he is my commander and he thinks its best to try and spread his message in other ways.

Shane and its at the end of the day you are all human and I must and will respect you. Shane this time.

[bamasmith]

I am just posting this to get my count up by 1. That is about all this thread is good for now..Wonder how long it will take for me to get to 100....