Your take on the St Louis Transworld Show 2009

[Kelly Anderson]

For those who have attended or will be attending the Transworld show:

I've been going to the Transworld shows for the past 6 years now. Although I missed the Vegas show 2 years ago. As a haunter and a retailer I liked attending both the party show and the haunt show. There were several companies I had hopes of seeing that ended up not being there. I had heard that there was an earlier date for the party show.

Whats your take on having those shows held on seperate dates?

Kelly Anderson
HauntYourHouse.NET

[Spookyfinder]

My thoughts...

-Hauntshow dates... LATE March to early April!
-Location, I LOVE St. Louis... but I want to be further south, maybe Atlanta? Nashville? Louisville? I think it shouldn't go any more west than the Mississippi River and any more north than the Interstate 64 corridor.
-Two shows... we are lucky to have our own show, we don't need the reatil side. The MAJORITY of haunts, don't sell retail. If you do... GO TO THE RETAIL SHOW! Yeah, they're good to have around to 'look at'... but do they benefit our show, hell no!

There's ALOT of discussion on this, ALOT of arguements... my thoughts on it all won't ever change... this is just how I could see the best possible HAUNTshow. -Tyler

[xxxdirk]

One show, Chicago, Late March

[drfrightner]

Here we go again crying for the one show thing... There might not even BE A HALLOWEEN show in Chicago atleast the way you know it. All of those vendors for the Halloween show are doing one or the other or if they do both they'll scale down to nearly nothing at one or the other. They just like us can't afford this nine billion shows.

Its probably going to come down to one or the other and right now all signs point to Houston... would you have our vendors go there and be treated like second class citizens and pay $2500.00 for a booth? Would you prefer to go there and have retail vendors tell you 'we won't sell to you'.

Time to move on!

We got this show started just in time before the bomb went off! Let the retail people do what they need to do we shouldn't worry about it we are ATTRACTION OWNERS!

I will tell you this much before its all said and done a lot of those retail vendors you think so much of will be at the Haunt Show in 2010.

Once we can ALL move past the fact that those days are OVER, we can start to focus on what IS and not what isn't. What is, is that we have our own show and many halloween vendors want to come!

Lets grow this show not a retail show.

In the end I hope Transworld prevails over Rubies in this Halloween retail slugfest but whatever happens there doesn't concern me I'm not interested in Batman costumes.

Larry

[xxxdirk]

Well, the question was what I would like to see happen. It is my choice, the same way it is yoyur choice, Larry, to plead your case for St Louis. Hell, if I had a haunt in St Louis, and the chance to sell 1000 tickets at $50 a pop, I would be drooling over the convention too. I dont blame you man, it's a chance to showcase your haunt and it is just smart business and you are a pretty smart business man.

As far as what will happen with the costume side of the show, that is TW to decide. All I know is that the TW show in Chicago was a huge show, worthy of national media coverage IMHO. It was packed there Fri & Sat and even 1/2 of the day on Sun. Then in 2007, SOMETHING happened. No one really knows exactly what was said in the meeting of the Rubies and the other big boys, but for whatever reason, some of the vendors went with Houston and some to Vegas. I was at Vegas and it sucked in 2008. It seems that Houston was a success, and then from the reports I heard Vegas sucked SO bad this year and so now TW is moving the Costume show back to Chicago in 10. St Louis was an OK convention, but still, in the scheme of things really small compared to what TW used to have. Heck, I saw the ENTIRE show floor in 2 hours!Is it a media worthy event? Maybe, but not as a huge event that Chicago used to be. It would take me at least 2 full days to see all of Chicago's floor!!

So where are we at? IMHO, and it is MHO, TW has a lot of damage control to do. If I was TW I would be on the phone right now, begging as many vendors to come back to the Chicago for the costume show. I would basically be giving my booth space away at a breakeven/make as little profit as I can to fill that booth space and make as big of a show as I can. I would then do whatever it took to get the buyers to come including updating my website more than just a week before the show!! Then I would, in 2011, move the haunt convention back to Chicago and make the convention the Godzilla of all conventions.
Will any of this happen? IDK. To me it makes good sense, but I am just a little fish......

[Darkblood]

If the show was in Chicago I'd have a place to stay free as my brother-in-law lives near there in Antioch.
lol
I'm all for the show in Titusville, Pennsylvania...lol
Hey so what if it's a town of 6000 people only...it's got that 'rustic charm'!
lol
I'll be looking forward to hopefully making it next year wherever (getting laid off this year didn't help making it so)...
And right after I read Ron's post...and was scrolling down and saw Larry responded...I thought "Uh oh!" lol
Kirk

[UndeadProd]

My take, with all due respect:

Transworld is 9 to 10 months away

My haunt opens in less than 4 months.

Much more focused on Sept/October than Feb/March.

Just sayin'

[drfrightner]

Ron,

Its not about a haunt opening, I would be saying the same thing now, as I was saying 5 years ago the haunt industry needs its own show period! We proved we are big enough to have our own show and its going to grow. Its about our industry not any haunt tour, not one vendor over another vendor, its about the whole industry.

Look man we are two different people, I don't let people kick me around, I fight for what I believe in, I fight against people who tell me I'm not good for them... the retail industry hated us, I was told several times we're nothing we mean nothing to Halloween.

Well I think our end had the successful show not their end...right?

We showed them! Now they kick the tires to see if we'd come to Houston...my only repsonse is F*CK OFF! You had your chance and you treated us like dirt! Aside from that end, we are not retailers we have different needs such what kind of buyers we need for our vendors, to what types of education should be provided.

We are a different industry whether you want to embrace that or not we are NOT Halloween retailers! We have 100 times more in common with Six Flags than Spirits! My main point to you and others is stop crying about that silly Halloween retail show its nearly worthless to you and make the show you have better. If you want to see other sorts of vendors call them tell them, encourage them!

See what I'm saying.

Larry

[Kelly Anderson]

Transworld show

Like one of you guys said here earlier, Im all for making the haunt show even bigger and better.

Ive been doing a charity haunt now for the past 7 years. Ive been to the TW shows almost every year since. YOU BET I want to see a KICK-BUTT haunt show. But the fact of reallity is that not every body attending the haunt show is going to spend a thousand dollars or more on a prop. Wether Im there representing my business or my haunt, there has always been a time (for me anyway) when Im dealing with businesses from both sides.

I think alot of the succes of the haunt show comes from the party show, but without a dout, the party show benifts from the haunt show as well.

And if some of you arent there to buy "Batman" costumes, thats fine with me. But having those two shows together, generates more buyers. And more buyers will bring more vendors and most likely a bigger and better haunt show. (my opinion)

Thanks alot for everyones feed back!

Kelly Anderson
HauntYourHouse.NET

[graystone]

Its my turn!

I still would like to see the shows combined. I have no problem with it at all. Heck call it the Haunted Attraction Halloween Haunt Show for all I care. I think the retail side still offered some good make up and costume vendors that Haunt owners could use.

Now moving forward as much as I want this to happen I don't think it will. At this point feelings are hurt, vendors are hurt, buyers are hurt and tired of the 100 different shows. I do feel and think that some of the Halloween show vendors will start to vend at the Haunt show.

I was aginst it from the start and went head to head with Larry several times over this. I will give him this and guys this is going to hurt me more than any animal bite I have ever had. But I got to say....... well what I got to say is.........ummmmmm....... well he...... well he was RIGHT! Ok there I said it. I think he was actually right this time and got to say I am sorry I was totally wrong on this one! There said it and moved on LOL! I think we made it out just in time. I will also say I blame RUBIES FOR ALL OF THIS. I now refuse to buy anything directly from them for my stores! Actually I had already had my fill of the way they treat mom and pop stores. We put them where they are at today and now all they give A DAMN ABOUT IS WAL-MART! As far as second class they been treating us that way for years now so as far as being in the retail business we were already used to that!!

Anyway again its best we move on and encourage some of the better makeup and costume Halloween vendors to join the Haunt show! So whos with me? Shane and its I am still hurting over this one LOL! Shane this time!

[michaeldavy]

AS FAR AS MAKE UP
Haunters go to TW to buy products in bulk because they are end users - use ALOT-
I agree there is no reason that they SHOULD pay retail for thier makeup IF they are buying quantity, and most do.

I get complaints from retailers who sell my make up at a 30% discount after a 60 % mark up . they make less but more of it. They get upset because I sell to haunters as well as retailers. My solution was (and still is) :

small quantities 1oz 2oz 4oz are packaged for retail sale on a wholesale discount while larger sizes 16oz, 32oz, gal, 5 gal etc are on a flat volume discount by virtue of its size. Most end users will be using the larger sizes and are happy for the discoutn and the wise retailers will buy the bulk and break it down for the big profits

I feel that both retailers and haunters can be satisfied why can't TW with one show. I really don't care about chi or stl. but I will say that TW has a long way to go to build my trust again after Vegas. I would rather see 20 small shows charging 300 for a booth than another Vegas with few buyers and a 2000 booth and another 2000 in freight charges.

I couldn't GIVE catalogs away. I have NEVER been to a show where I couldn't give stuff away Until Vegas.
for what Vegas cost me I could have done MWHC, hauntcon, and numerous twicons or comic cons.

[drfrightner]

Yeah Vegas was a TOTAL BUST... I personally don't think going to Chicago is going to change anything nor is going to Houston. One show will die and one show will live just have to see what happens.

But thankfully we don't have to worry about it!

As haunters we have our own SHOW!

Larry

[Grimley]

We decided just to go to Houston next year. I can't stomach Chicago any more and if was anything like Vegas this year it will die in 2010. This will be the first time in six years that we will not attend the Transworld Halloween show.

[Mr Nightmarez]

The combination show offered more for me than the Haunt Show alone. But as we are all different people and different views... that's just me.

I know that they (Retail Side) don't like us. But I also know I bought a lot from those companies along w/ the Haunt stuff... now I'm having to go to multiple shows, where I could kill all in one show. (But I guess that's my problem) but the other offerings were good for haunters too, but that was then and this is now...

I believe Atlanta - Nashville - St. Louis - triple threat rotation for the Haunt Show would be a good way to work it. Being in St. Louis every year would suck. But if it moved every other year or yearly to a Central US City that might not see snow - that would be great. And by rotating the cities - you get a chance to see more than just Larry's show. (Been there done that now)

The SHOW was amazing and was better than I anticipated. The after show events sucked. (IMO) Other than a couple cool bars we found within blocks of the hotel.

[GoryCorey]

Lets keep a few things in perspective.

Expo halls over the past 10 years demand 2 year contracts.

Hence Vegas 2008-2009.

Chicago 2010-2011 for TW HPS.
From what I understand in 2011, TW is hoping to bring both shows under the same roof in Stephenson again.

HPE (Houston January Show) has existed prior to 2009, as a much smaller early show comparable to the NYC Toy Center Early show (Also produced by TW in December), it is just 1 month later.

They (Houston) renamed and repackaged the show and used Rubies, and PaperFirst muscle to leverage buyers to that "new" show.

FYI - the big buyers have already done 90% of their purchasing in December.
Houston is picking up the slack from the mostly smaller companies (and there are many) who need to buy for their stores.
Some major buyers come to hopefully find a few items for the big box stores they did not see in December.

The vendor issue, is for the small to moderate sized companies who make both retail and Haunt products, not unlike Minions Web.
We need to cater to both markets.

As a vendor I can tell you it take no less than 3-5 grand to walk out the door and attend a show.
But to do both shows, is a considerable expense, one that we have to sell a lot more merchandise to cover the additional show costs.
A bad show means mark ups to the retail market to cover expenses.

Houston, was not the swarmed with buyers event some few vendors claimed it to be, trust me.

We were there with our booth, it was terrible for many vendors, large and small.
I got to know a number of them quite well while in between doing the Billy Mays hawking.
There was a lot more talking time than hawking time.

From those who sold or attended at LV that I have spoken to, Houston was not the bloodbath of Vegas, but it was not Hauntshow numbers by any stretch.

You know we did both Houston and St Louis - St Louis was a pleasant surprise.
We did not know what to expect with Hauntshow this year.
I had been displeased with the overall costs to do Vegas.
St Louis was an improvement though we there were additional expenses to do St Louis vs Chicago.

Now if the shows do reconverge again in Chicago in 2011 as I have been told, I do not know what to think about it.

It would make life easier for vendors to show to both audiences in one location.
Many of us have crossover buyers, many of you want to look at both sections, if not for products, for ideas.

But will the "other buyers" come to a consolidated show again after this and next years debacles?